Canadian Lyme Disease Foundation Bulletin Board

[Mum]

If you have already had the Swine flu vaccine, please let the rest of us know if you had any unusual adverse reactions. This would be helpful to those who are wondering how the shot might affect their Lyme disease and associated conditions.

[linlai]

Holding off for the time being -- I thought I might wait until the un adjuvanted version is available, but also don't have two and a half hours during the work week to get it. Though, I think that horse may already be out the barn door, for me, as I'm pretty sure that I'm now recovering from H1N1 -- it's been all around my work place. Started off like a cold (and no fever the whole time) but lots of coughing and still not quite out of my chest. My littlest may have had it as well -- and not sure if X. is coming down with it or if she's just having some herx symptoms from her Tinidazole pulse week. (My bigger concern for her is so much exposure at school -- they've had quite a few absences and no one seems to figure it out until they've been sick for a few days or get the high fever version.

I do know of a few U.S. friends and their children who have had it (the U.S. version -- not adjuvanted) several of them immediately came down with what seems to be the flu, though it may have been prior exposure.

L.

[twinkle]

Hi L -Posted this elsewhere last night.
Heard a CBC call in on Wed 28 pm.
The seemingly honest doctor listed the adjuvent contents.
Seemed innocuous to my overly cautious and cynical anti-vaccine brain.
Thinking of checking out her info.
Of course you know what happened here in ON a few days ago. Surprised by the rapid advance of this awful disease, so am re-thinking the vaccine.
Hope X is better. twinkle

[linlai]

And I now know quite a few adults and kids who had it and no one seems to have had anything too severe, though a few who've come down with the flu immediately (though seeing how fast it's spreading here, I don't doubt they've already been exposed).

My main concern has been the thimerosol, for me, as I've had allergic reactions to contact lens solutions that have that ingredient in common.

However, with X. who likely has it, and suspecting that Rachel and I had it earlier in the summer in the first round, I'm not really sure it will be of great value...might consider the seasonal flu shot this year, though. Anyway, it's all moot until X. is out of her week of staying at home.

L.

[John from BC]

folks, don't listen to the CBC, its trying in a very cynical way to "fear people" into taking this very dubious vaccine.

Think about the many things that don't add up.
1) it suddenly appears in Mexico out of nowhere, we are told its linked to the "pig farms" but nothing is done to clean it up or kill the infected animals, the issue about the pigs is "dropped" by the media/

2) a normal development phase for all vaccines starts in December of every year and takes 9 months to develop from there, using a method where the actual virus is killed with formeldahyde but the anigenic DNA is left intact for te body to "react to".

3) if the the outbreak was in April 16th, 2009..that means up to now that its been less than 7 months. Some doctors are saying that in order for the vaccine to be developed that quickly you need to "skip steps' , in this case the introduction of small amounts " of live virus", this is both dangerous and unethical.
4) think about the actual name "swine flu", any virologist will tell you that influenza strains" do not "migrate" from species to species, there are DNA firewalls that prevent this....so
5) a set of Doctors, namely Doctor Ott, Dr. Horowitz have done their own research and found that this is a recombanant influenza strain, in otherwords its "manmade"..it does not happen in nature..this can only mean one thing, the virus was deliberately released into a "targeted population"
6) to do the above is a "terrorist crime in both Canada and the USA, it is a Bio weapon assault on the general population.
7) why is the media as in many other issues being the "delivery boy" instead of asking critical important questions???
why were "body bags" sent to First Nations communities in Northern Canada?
9) why did the "swine flu" just suddenly "show up" on Meares Island" BC
10) did you know that as a First Nations person, under Canadian Law I cannot "refuse" a swine flu " or forced vaccination
11) why, some 3 years prior to this, the USA Patriot ACT 11 had a "rider" provision" protecting all Pharmaceutical companies from any lawsuits in regards to vaccinations specifically?
12) why did Canada pass a very similar law in July of this year
13)Did you know that Donald Rumsfeld is invovled in this whole thing..

read on..

http://www.motherjones.com/transition/inter.php?dest=http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2009/04/swine-flu-bringing-home-bacon


There are so many holes in this swine flu thing , to say nothing of the squaline and Thimerisol, which is also linked way back to Elli Lily and the Bush family in the 1930's...

Folks, we live in very different times, our government no long serves the interest or well being of the people, the media overall including the BBC and CBC can no longer be trusted.
Be informed, do your own research and don't give into the fear and panic that is being generated by the media.

Of course if we all dealt with the "fear of dying" on a personal level, we would not be so easily goaded by this kind of propaganda either, because this is what is giving this "Sail" its wind.

Regards, JRM

[cathie]

I am a healthcare worker and have Lyme. After reading a memo from one of our Docs I felt much more secure in getting it so I had it 3 days ago with no ill affects other than it hurt like a bugger going in and had a sore arm for a couple of days. As we all have chronic illness I would advise all to get it. Rest assured that I was not going to get it at first but after reading his memo became convicted

[John from BC]

[twinkle]

Hello there - I posted the CBC interview information as just that - information - with no prejudice except for saying that what the doctor interviewed had listed as the adjuvents in this vaccine might be looked into by anyone seeking to make their own, very personal, INFORMED decision. This is just one piece of a multifaceted information stream, and I am glad to hear that the CBC might be compromised in their reporting. Certainly a possibility.
HOWEVER it is my belief that each one of us must come to our own decision vis a vis this vaccine based on our own personal information. thus I posted this as info only..
I certainly do not plan to believe any one source on this issue. I hope no one else does either.
Personal history: I have jumped through hoops for 14 yrs. bec. I refused to vaccinate my children. Schools, medical estab. etc.
But I am thinking through both sides on this vaccine and want to help everyone out here to do the same - which was my intention in posting the CBC info. I will not say yeah or nay to anyone. This is PERSONAL. None of us know for certain at this point. Also, I do trust Dr, M. and he has come down on the side of taking this vaccine. No one is the be all or end all in this kind of situation - but I think that Dr. M has a VERY good brain and I am thinking hard on this issue as his words have had an impact for me. I still have not decided what we will do. But I think there is no hard line on this issue. twinkle

[Alison]

For what it is worth, the doctors at the UK Lyme Convention this fall recomended ( to put it mildly) that people with compromised imune systems should NOT have the flu shot or the H1N1 shot. The argument being that you do not want to overload your already overloaded imune system.

[Chels]

Well . . . I wasn't planning on getting the vax for H1N1 and now I don't have to worry about it since I am recovering from "the flu". I am told that H1N1 is the only flu circulating right now and several people on our block and at work (a school) and my kid's school have been diagnosed with H1N1 (through swabs) . . . so pretty certain it was H1N1.
It was very mild and only lasted a few days. The only thing I noticed is that I seem to be more out of breath than I remember during other flu's. That was the first fever I've had since contracting lyme 2 1/2 years ago.
Anyway, just wanted to tell you my experience

[linlai]

I was leaning towards getting myself and my other daughter vaccinated (but not X.) -- but the long line ups and our work/school day made it impossible last week. (Now they are out of it in Alberta, so not going to be happening at all---and at this point it's really only the seasonal flu shot that might be beneficial. May get myself and my younger one in for that when she's better.) The "the big oink" spread through X.'s and my younger daughter's schools last week. X. got it first and my little now has it now. I figure I may have had a very mild version two weeks ago -- I thought it was a particularly bad cold, as I didn't get the fever. Since I haven't gotten sick while being coughed, sputtered on etc. by the girls, it's looking pretty likely that I had it first.

X. also had her first fever in two years -- while I treated the fever at night and for comfort, I didn't medicate them when it was under 102 unless she was complaining, because one thing I do remember from the fever she got while in hospital with her severe neuro Lyme symtpoms was that the fever seemed to lead to a month of improvements. Those spiros don't like heat, so I am hoping that we've got some incidental benefits from getting sick. Today (also her usual four week herx time) she's acting quite 'herxy'--maybe just the crankiness etc. at the tail end of the flu, but I'm suspecting we've got some added 'die off' in the air, as well.

One thing that may be something of an advantage for Lymies is the fact that many are already on antibiotics and so, depending on the meds, may avoid the secondary infections that seem to be hitting others. X. is still on Ceftin, and that's used for lung infections -- her chest definitely cleared quickly, as did her fever. (She's now more than 24 hours fever free, so I think she'll be ready to go back to school soon -- will probably keep her home one more day, since her sister will be home anyway.) Oh, and X. also seemed to have a bit of the 'out of breath' issue -- she was making some breathing sounds that I associate with her babs treatment, sort of a grunting to get her breath. When I was sick, for a couple of nights I was waking myself up with something similar, but since I thought I had a cold, just assumed it was asthma.

In my case, I did find that Cold FX seemed to reduce my symptoms---if I'd known it was the flu I would have also taken oscillinium, as in the past that's been quite effective for me in shortening duration of flu. For X. I just pushed hot liquids, vitamins and broth with ginger and garlic.

My theory is that a lot of the people who are getting sicker from the flu are those who have very good immune systems that are going into overdrive.

Linda

[Denise]

I was going to get the flu shot as well. Lined up outside a clinic this morning- only to have someone come around and say they ran out of vaccine.

Now, only people who can prove they are at risk get it. I have asthma, so technically I count, but it's been so mild for the last couple of years, I don't have an inhaler on me at the moment, and my family Dr.'s in a different city.

I'd still like to get it, but I'll have to wait and see how things work out.

Nicole

[oldchina]

I feel I must wade in here. I completely agree with John from BC. Thank-you John. However, I have learned that "If you change a man against his will, he'll be of the same opinion still." If anyone is really interested in becoming informed, they must perform their own extensive research. If they feel the issue is not important enough, then so be it. I personally do not buy into the hype of the H1N1 and will not even for a second consider a shot. My parents are 90 and 92 respectively and have never had any shots whatsoever. They have been married 68 years with narry a stint in the hospital. There is something to be said for healthy eating and a positive attitude and the effects on ones immune system. Now, with respect to Lyme which we all have, our immune systems do not need another assault to add insult to injury. No shot for me. Ever.

[Alison]

Hi "oldchina"
Thanks for putting my thoughts into words.
Positive attitude, good wholesome food( certified organic as much as possible) and try to not get emotional, are all mentioned in that Lyme book by 13 doctors.
My folks lived without shots till ripe old ages.
I too will decline the pressure/hype to have either flu shot or H1N1.

[lookingforanswers]

Just my opinion.
http://ottawa.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20091102/OTT_Be_Calm_091102/20091102/?hub=OttawaHome
Doctors put swine flu risk in perspective
Updated: Mon Nov. 02 2009 18:13:13

ctvottawa.ca

As the second wave of swine flu makes its way through the region, doctors are reminding residents to stay calm.

One to two out of every million people will die of swine flu. Meanwhile, people are 35 times more likely to die of seasonal flu.

While it's important to protect yourself, Dr. Louise McNaughton-Filion said residents need to keep in mind that seasonal flu is more common and more deadly than H1N1.

The deaths of two young Ontario children who were otherwise healthy have contributed to a lot of fear, she said.

"My heart goes out to the families that are affected by H1N1 in a severe way, but we have to remember that it's a small number compared to those affected by the seasonal flu."

According to McNaughton-Filion, taking a common sense approach is one of the best ways to protect yourself from the virus.

"Everybody has to take care of themselves: wash their hands; get rest; drink fluids. If they have a cold -- stay home; if they're well -- go about their usual business," she said.

Since the second wave of swine flu, emergency rooms are seeing an influx in patients with flu-like symptoms and flu clinics across the region are faced with long lineups of people waiting to get the H1N1 vaccine.

"I'm finding a weird range of indifference to terrible fear," said Shannon Walls, a health care volunteer who works in palliative care.

At Ottawa schools, the fear has some parents keeping their children home from school even when they're healthy.

"Our message to parents in conjunction with Ottawa public health is business as usual and our schools are open," said Julian Hanlon of the Ottawa Catholic School Board.

Symptoms of swine flu include:

fever
cough
muscle aches
fatigue
severe headache
sore throat
lack of appetite
More severe indicators include:

shortness of breath or difficulty breathing
chest pain
bluish or grey skin
bloody or coloured mucous
sudden dizziness or confusion
severe or persistent vomiting
high fever for more than three days
low blood pressure
With a report from CTV Ottawa's Catherine Lathem